Soliferum/The Case of Duke Maximus against Count Shaun

Editor's note: The color-codes are only different to separate one message from another, not to separate one side of the discussion from the other.

Duke Maximus announces the sale of Todtpiz from Osaliel to Ortedail (reference letter)
Maximus Testaverde, Minister of Finances of Soliferum, Duke of Osaliel		09 March 1008
Lords and Knights of the Duchy of Osaliel, and those of the Republic. As the Duke and therefore wearer of the royal Ducal Crown of Osaliel and on that authority I have decided to sell the lands of Todtpiz to Duke Diaramesis and the Duchy of Ortedail. We have been in talks, involving the 3rd Duke in Osaliel Duke Viracocha along with the prime minister and his council for some time now. But in the end this move was solely up to myself and the Duke of Ortedail. Let no one in the future near or far ever dispute who Todtpiz belongs to, Ortedail has agreed to pay a set amount and it has been overseen by others. The reason their were others to wittiness is so that no claims of Todtpiz being just given over and then being used in the future as a debt owed to Osaliel for political favor. This transaction is between the 2 crowns of Osaliel and Ortedail and will be completed once the finally payment has been delivered to Osaliel. Baron Shaun will not be retained at the regions commander, his replacement has yet to be announced. I will answer any question that any of you may have at this time

Region changes duchy
Unknown official magistrate		11 March 1008
Shaun d'Peabee, Baron of Todtpiz has changed the allegiance of his region Todtpiz to the duchy of Ortedail.

Maximus' accusations
Maximus Testaverde, Minister of Finances of Soliferum, Duke of Osaliel		12 March 1008
Shaun since you have chosen to ignore my letters and my request I will offer you one move chance here before your friends in this senate to explain yourself. You was entrusted with a region of my duchy, the region of Todtpiz, you served it well and you was well taken care of for your service, but now you have breached your oath to me and to my duchy has have removed my Osaliel banners and replaced them with Duke Diaramesis of Ortedail. This is not acceptable and unless theres some sort of misunderstanding in all of this you will be held accountable for your actions. Todtpiz belongs to Osaliel and to me as it's Duke, you have broken the very fabric of what holds our duchies and this Republic together. You have 2 days to stand before me and this senate to correct your actions or I will fulfill my Ducal rights and correct them myself

Shaun's defence
Shaun d'Peabee, Baron of Todtpiz		12 March 1008
You are the one, Maximus, that announced the sale of Todtpiz. My assumption when I was informed that you took the gold from Todtpiz's coffers was that the sale was complete. Was I mistaken? Was your thievery not persuant to that transaction? As the sale was a private matter between you and Duke Diaramesis, I suppose I should have asked and was a tad bit presumptuous. My apologies. But then I suppose I can consider your theft a breaking of your oath of protection to me and my region as well if it was not, indeed, a condition of the transaction. So either way, I'm afraid you don't have much ground to stand on here, Maximus.

Baeryn mediates
Baeryn Lorn, Baron of Azohib		12 March 1008
Baron Shaun, I do not know any details upon sale process of Todtpiz so I can not comment that. However I am amazed at your comment about Duke Maximus's rights over Todtpiz. Todtpiz is (or was) part of Duchy of Osaliel. Duke Maximus is in charge of the Duchy. It is in hands to decide what to do with it. He can appoint and dismiss local lord as he wishes. He can take Todtpiz's tax gold if he wishes. Same goes to Azohib and all the regions that belongs to his Duchy. You are calling your Duke thief which is not the smartest thing in my opinion. Do you think that will improve your chances to maintain your status as a local lord? Do you think that any other Duke will want to grant you position in thier regions after this? Do you even understand how our Duchy system works? with respect

Foreign defends Shaun
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		13 March 1008
Baeryn, it may be so for the Duke to do as he pleases with his duchy. However it is just as well Shaun's right to change his allegiance when he doesn't like it. In essence, it is the region lord who controls the region, not his Duke.

Conan replies to Foreign
Sir Conan McGahee, Prime Minister of Soliferum, Marshal of the Army of the Republic		13 March 1008
Baron Foreign, I must correct a misconception on your part. The lands of the ducjy belongs to the Duke, his regional lords are entrusted to oversee those lands for the Duke, the Regional lords do not own the lands, they are owned by the Duchy, the Regional lord had no right to remove any lands from any Duchy.. Shaun, accusing your Duke of stealing is bold, but even bolder when you say he stoled something thats his in the first place. It is troublesome to see so many ignore the foundation that our Republic is set upon, but then I take full responsibility for it, perhaps I have failed in educating all on our history and the ways of this Feudal Republic.

Foreign replies to Conan
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		13 March 1008
"the Regional lord had no right to remove any lands from any Duchy Unfortunately, Shaun did do so and all his people followed. So he must've had the right. Or we could just ignore our people's wishes as the good republic we are, and feed some more of them to Cid while looking away. Out of respect for Soliferum this letter was solemnly posted to this Senate.

Shaun's accusations to Maximus
Shaun d'Peabee, Baron of Todtpiz		13 March 1008
Asking his subjects to send him more gold is one thing. Changing the books to cover the fact that his men took large portions of gold from the region is theft, plain and simple. His intent was clearly to clandestinely and without proper recourse to take from Todtpiz and its knights and lord. One wonders how many other regions he has taken from thusly in his role as Minister of Finanace.

Conan asks evidence
Sir Conan McGahee, Prime Minister of Soliferum, Marshal of the Army of the Republic		13 March 1008
Senator Shaun, if you wish to bring forth a case against Duke Maximus then do so with some evidence. Senator Foreign, the peasants of Todtpiz should do as their Baron instructs them, they know little and should care of little other than tending to the lands and keeping up with what taxes their Baron has levied, why should they see reason to dispute matters out of their control?

Conan travels to mediate
Sir Conan McGahee, Prime Minister of Soliferum, Marshal of the Army of the Republic		13 March 1008
I will be heading straight to Todtpiz to see what I can do to settle this matter.

Maximus' ultimatum
Maximus Testaverde, Minister of Finances of Soliferum, Duke of Osaliel		13 March 1008
(((Duke Maximus stands before the full senate and addresses Shaun in a calm voice))) Shaun, you have failed me and I am through with trying to bring you back into my house. Hear me now, you have 3 days to return my banners over Todtpiz and leave my lands, if you do not then you will be dealt with as your actions have warranted. I am a just and honest man that has given much of my life for what I believe in and thats this Republic, I am a tolerant man with much mercy, but you have exceeded your limits and you will not be given anymore passes. Three days, that is all.

Shaun's evidence
Shaun d'Peabee, Baron of Todtpiz		14 March 1008
Shaun motions to his aide and the aide brings in several recordkeeping books. The aide whispers very briefly in his ear to which Shaun nods and then dismisses the aide. "You may examine them yourself, Prime Minister. I have left the notes marking the 'errors' where my scribes placed them so that the discrepancies will be easy to find. The latest was discovered from today's notes in fact. "Of course, these are only from where Maximus was sloppy. Who knows what treachery I and my servants might have missed." Gold disappearing (6 days, 2 hours ago) Something fishy is going on in Soliferum. The tax books appear to have been tampered with and some gold is missing from the chests. Gold disappearing (5 days, 6 hours ago) Something fishy is going on in Soliferum. The tax books appear to have been tampered with and some gold is missing from the chests. Gold disappearing (2 hours, 5 minutes ago) Something fishy is going on in Soliferum. The tax books appear to have been tampered with and some gold is missing from the chests.

Foreign's mediation
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		14 March 1008
Shaun seems to have presented proper evidince to at least halt any charges laid against him. I suggest Maximus explains himself and refrains from any actions against Count Shaun.

Conan's defence for Maximus
Sir Conan McGahee, Prime Minister of Soliferum, Marshal of the Army of the Republic		14 March 1008
Shaun those tampered with books do not necessarily point to Duke Maximus, Most of the time they are a result of infiltrators and even other things, but on the surface they dont seem to be worthy of accusing in such a way as you have, I do hope that you have more.

Foreign advocating for Shaun's evidence
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		14 March 1008
I find the proof provided by Shaun direct enough to build a firm case against Maximus. As the witnesses state: Something fishy is going on in Soliferum. The tax books appear to have been tampered with and some gold is missing from the chests. The tax books have been tampered with. Now, lets presume we are talking about the realm’s tax books. The only authority allowed near these tax books are the Prime Minister and the Minister of Finances. Besides, you have to know how to work with these books, which (being a region lord gives me some insight) is rather difficult math. Even more, to make such a scam blend in perfectly with the rest of the book’s data you’d have to know quite a deal about the realm’s regular finances so that it would appear normal. We can easily exclude any scribes or non-noble citizens because of these preconditions (difficult math and thorough knowledge of the realm’s expenditures and income). That leaves our PM or MF as only possible suspects. Then let us assume these are the tax books of Shaun’s region only, because as far as I know only he was notified of the crime. That would mean that four people have access to it and enough knowledge to change it. Such are Shaun himself, his Duke, the PM and the MF. Since his Duke and the MF are the same person, namely Maximus, our list of suspects is yet again limited to PM Conan or MF Maximus. There is hardly any way to deny either the clarity or the severity of these charges.

NLaw disagrees to the evidence
NLaw Lawson		14 March 1008
Foreign I have to disagree, a inflatator(sp?) Could break into a vault and steal some gold and tamper with the books. It doesnt have to be any of the four you mentioned.

Foreign's replies to NLaw
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		14 March 1008
That's where you're wrong, Sir NLaw. An infiltrator could not possible have the knowledge on tampering with books, and even if it did, it would take him days if not weeks to study the finances of our realm to make his attempt to pilfer the money look real and hard to spot. If I were to go through the trouble of understanding the entire financial system of some foreign realm just to get gold, I'd rather just grab the money and be done with it. This was, obviously, done by a man with much inside knowledge and expertise.

Maximus replies to the accusations
Maximus Testaverde, Minister of Finances of Soliferum, Duke of Osaliel		14 March 1008
The Tax books of Todtpiz were in control of it's Regional Lord, He was responsible for collecting the regions taxes and then sending the proper share to the Duchy and to the realm. If there were poorly kept books in Todtpiz then it was under the hand of the one whom I placed in charge to over see that region. If I had a need for gold from Todtpiz or any other region of mine then I would instruct the regions Lord to send me a larger share. Shaun has been revoked from his Oath to Osaliel and he is to be stepping down from the Lords estate in Todtpiz, he has 2 more days to do it as a noble and try to live up to the code all nobles live under. Once Duke Diaramesis has completed his payment for Todtpiz then he is free to appoint his own Knight as the regions Lord. I have spoken with Duke Diaramesis and he has assured me that he never asked Shaun to change the Todtpiz banner from Osaliel to Ortedail. If Shaun done this on accident thinking he was suppose to, I will accept that and not push for actions against him, but I would expect him to state this and then step down and leave the estate I appointed him to oversee some 3 years ago.

Maximus calls for a vote
Maximus Testaverde, Minister of Finances of Soliferum, Duke of Osaliel		15 March 1008
Senate, Not that a Duke should have to come before you to deal with a wayward Knight under his oath but since in this case it involves our Republic along with my rights as a Duke I wish to bring up a vote to have Shaun removed from Soliferum all together. He has stated that he believes not in what Soliferum stands for and for vowing to turn against it, He has admitted to talking with those that want to overthrow the government but has decided to fight it from within. He said before us all (((When this government turned against that belief, I turned against the government. And so I will fight until I am no doubt silenced by our megalomaniacal Judge. Not from outside the system as some would have me do as it is always easier to rally and fight the outsider, but from within, as I am a member of this Republic and would see it change for the better if I can))) He has shown contempt for our form of government and has now made it his goal to bring it down. I will start the votes by voting to ask Shaun to leave our Republic

Foreign votes "no"
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		15 March 1008
I will most definitely vote against the removal of Shaun from either his lordly position, either this Senate or this Republic. If the way of a Republic is to remove all those who oppose you, then this is no more than an embellished tyranny, as you leave no space anymore for any opposition in elections. You are, factually, securing your own position of power by removing all those who oppose you. Hell, I'd even vote to remove you if you're so fond of abusing a Senate for this purpose. Read this through carefully, Maximus. You're trying to win a personal struggle rather than look out for the best of your people. When Shaun pointed out how many citizens died in Osaliel through your neglect, instead of acting to save your people you chose to go into the defensive aagainst Shaun so you wouldn't lose face. The result is that hundreds if not thousands more died. You were selling Todtpiz to Ortedail weeks ago, but when the region moves on its own accord you must demand it back, just so you can order the new lord to give it back to Ortedail again? All of this just so you can cross Shaun. And the mere fact of the accusations laid against you for pilfering money you simply ignore. Yet they are so brutally clear and demand at least a responce from the prime suspect. It is disgusting that in order to maintain personal power and not lose face you must resort to abusing the Republic. I think all the citizens of Dsinanas will follow me in this statement. I think the people deserve to know,

NLaw votes 'yes'
NLaw Lawson		15 March 1008
I have to agree with maximus, lately shaun has done nothing to prove his loyalty to this realm. the realm marched to war and he stayed behind. Then he changed the region loyalty which is illegal to do in a republic.

Conan dismisses the Senate
Sir Conan McGahee, Prime Minister of Soliferum, Marshal of the Army of the Republic		15 March 1008
Senator Members End this foolishness NOW! Let me simplify a few things and lets stick to those and start clearing this matter up. 1) Peasants are NOT citizens and anything that happened in Osaliel was a religious matter. 2) Dukes own the lands in this Republic, they CAN NOT, be removed from their lands and they have their lands in this Republic because they WANT then to be. Duke have no power struggles, theres nothing that they can be forced to do or not do with their lands. 3) Republic citizens are the Nobles and their families, NOT peasants. 4) Cid is a ROYAL Noble and a Priest, No BODY can force him into doing anything, He can not be Banished, He can not be Fined due to he has no need for gold and collects no taxes. The manner in which Shaun has tried to resolve the matter is futile. In stead of blowing up and calling everyone that did not run at his call corrupt and rant that all is broken then perhaps Shauns attempts could have been more fruitful if he had actually found a way to work this body of Senators. 5) Todtpiz belongs to the Osaliel Duchy and hence Duke Maximus, how much of a right a Regional lord has is something that I believe could be hashed out and agreed upon by the Dukes if they wanted to remain in the Republic. The hostile route that Shaun has taken has not worked and it was not the way this body was meant to preform. I have not seen one thing come from the Senate, it was meant to be a civil way to, it was meant to connect the laws of the Republic to the rights of the Nobles of the Duchies. But it has been attempted to trample the Rights of the Dukes just for bringing THEIR lands into the republic. I want this VOTE stopped NOW, and I want this Body to do what it was designed to do, If it cant then I will scrap it all and we will find a replacement for the Senate because it has not be doing what it was meant to do. First things first, Todtpiz has been sold to the Ortedail Duchy, Shaun removed it prematurely. We will leave the past in the past and go on from here. I want to hear respectful speech within the Senate Halls with better chosen words used along with addressing others formally and with their due titles. Shaun will stay with Todtpiz until the fall, this will give all a chance to cool down and for this Senate to start to actually work, I want the first order ob business to be adapting rules for the Senate, rules as to how they are to speak to one another when addressing the entire chamber and how they go about bringing forth votes. The issue must be announced and then givin a set time to debate and then a vote is called. It is up to you all to lay down how the very basics of this body will preform in the future. If anyone is NOT in agreement with what I have just said I need to hear from you right away. We will talk more on this later I am sure. From the many many letter I have received in private most all of the Senate is unhappy with the way Shaun has behaved, to be honest there only two that stand with him.

Foreign request public openness
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		15 March 1008
Very well, then I'd formally like to request that the Republic Government divulges all information concerning both case Cid as case Shaun to the public. And with public I mean noble citizens, not the peasants if you so please. I'd hate to see these cases being hushed up behind Senate doors.

Tony replies to Foreign
Tony Saprano, General of Soliferum		15 March 1008
Baron Foreign forgive me if I misunderstood your words, but Soliferum is a Republic governed by representatives and the entire body as a whole have their say in elections. This don't however mean that they don't have a say in things in general but theres never a decision made as a whole other than in the general elections. Soliferum is not a democracy and subject to mob rule. I am for what our prime minister has asked and I would like to see us get on with what this elected body was intended to be.

Foreign replies to Tony
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		15 March 1008
The mob has got to be informed first to elect thereafter, Sir Tony. Otherwise the elections will be based on faulty rumours and whatever misconceptions that did reach the mob's ears. I think it is better if we make sure they hear the right version. It's not a good thing to keep our citizens in the dark.

Conan replies to Tony and Foreign
Sir Conan McGahee, Prime Minister of Soliferum, Marshal of the Army of the Republic		15 March 1008
Senator Foreign, please do not infer that our Nobles are a mob. As for elections that something for candidate to bring up during election. Minister Tony, I ask that you do the same and yes we are a Representative and not a Democracy you still refrain from calling Democracies mob rule. As I said before, theres nothing our Judge, myself or all of the Nobles in Soliferum can do directly to Cid, they can however speak with him or work out a compromise with him on matters, but trials and laws can not.

Foreign clarifies his statement
Foreign Curs, Baron of Dsinanas		15 March 1008
I refered to a "mob" to make the same point clear as you did, PM Conan. I thought that was clear enough?