User:Marc J./Luz Capital Debate2

Out-of-Character from Dead_Angel
Message sent to the Rulers of this world (20 recipients)
To Timothy

Your explanation about "tom said this" and "tom said that" and your "I am only protecting the rules" is a lot of bull[oney]. [Sorry Tom S., had to censor your word to get around the spam filter ~ Marc J.]

In this whole discussion you only attacked Luz de Bia to move their capital. Why? Of course roimbara benefits from the movement and thats your REAL motivation.

If you were really so integer as you like to give yourself, then why didnt you mention 1 single word about Sint moving their capital back to Fianik. Exactly, you have no benifit from that and it are your allies (i think).

I sometimes do not understand Tom. He complains about the bitchering in this game, but at the same time without no written rules he promote it. Or can you find somewhere in the manual that a strategical movement of the capital is not allowed. I know what he has said on the discussionlist after your endless complaining about a issue that is 4 months back. Again i want to point on that you only mention the LdB case instead i know that you know about several other strategical movements of the capital. Do you think its fair that LdB get punished with a lightbold and Sint didnt receive any punishment. Now you requesting another punishment of LdB for something they have been punished for already. In RL court someone can not be punished 2 times for the same offense.

Just my 2 cents.

Tom Struik

Out-of-Character from Bocephus
Message sent to the Rulers of this world (19 recipients)
Sint never had its ruler lightning bolted, never received any warning messages, etc. regarding its capital move. There are different circumstances in each situation which is why I think Timothy is sticking to the LDB/Rimobara situation since he is more familiar with it.

Todd F

Out-of-Character from Delvin
Message sent to the Rulers of this world (19 recipients)
(Copied to Tom S.)

At first, I gave equal time to Sint and Luz de Bia. However, Bocephus's player stated that he did not get lightning bolted, at which point I apologized, and focused my energies where Tom felt they were warranted.

If Bocephus's player had been lightning bolted, you may be certain that I would be putting as much into urging him to move Sint's capital as I am into urging you to move Luz de Bia's.

And frankly, I often don't understand Tom either, and I often don't agree with him. However, the rule against moving capitals for strategic purposes is a good one, and even if I disagreed with it, it is an important enough rule that I would probably help enforce it to the best of my ability, because it is a rule.

I believe that the rules are made for everyone and no one gets to slip out of them. Tom made perfectly clear that the lightning bolt was not meant as a punishment, but as a warning, and that he expected the culprits to undo their misdeeds.

I am also insulted by your assumption that I am taking IC issues OOC. As I have said before, I believe that Riombara can win this war even if Luz de Bia does not move their capital back, and I think it would be more prestigious to do so. I have long striven to separate the my IC and OOC feelings, and I will swear by anything that will make you believe me that I am doing this for one reason and one reason only: because by Tom's own words, Luz de Bia is in violation of the rules against moving capitals for strategic purposes.

And finally, I am surprised that you, of all people, a former beta-tester and coder, would so defy Tom's rules as to advocate keeping the capital where it is. You should be ashamed of yourself.

I am working to make this game a cleaner place, where those who abuse the game are not allowed to profit from their illicit actions. What are you doing?

Timothy Collett

Out-of-Character from Marc
Message sent to the Rulers of this world (19 recipients)
(copied to Tom S.)

Do you think its fair that LdB get punished with a lightbold and Sint didnt receive any punishment. Now you requesting another punishment of LdB for something they have been punished for already. In RL court someone can not be punished 2 times for the same offense.

Honestly, no, not really... but, like you said, I don't always understand Tom.

I also wasn't privy to the facts in the Sint case - nor was I consulted.

Which means, I have to muggle through the best that I can with what facts I can find.

To me, it's like this:

Both Luz and Sint moved their capital. Tom, (to the best of my knowledge) judged that both movements where stratigic in nature, but only lighting-bolted the Luzian Ruler. (Don't know if it was Nhoc at the time)

Again, to the best of my knowledge, the only reason the Luzian Ruler was LB'ed was because they moved their capital. Now, to me, that means that the capital should have been moved back - by either Tom doing it, or Nhoc doing it.

Whether this is a "second case" or not is debatable, (depending on your view, it could also be a continuation of the first case, with Tom's "dishonourable scum" email as new evidence) but, in the end, Luz's capital, (accourding to Tom, not little ole me!) should not be in Grehk.

There are different circumstances in each situation which is why I think Timothy is sticking to the LDB/Rimobara situation since he is more familiar with it.

The same reason here is for me as well.

And finally, I am surprised that you, of all people, a former beta-tester and coder, would so defy Tom's rules as to advocate keeping the capital where it is. You should be ashamed of yourself.

I am working to make this game a cleaner place, where those who abuse the game are not allowed to profit from their illicit actions. What are you doing?

:shoots Tim a look:

In my opinion, Tom S., you are a "senior" player. Multiple Rulerships, General's, Judge's, Region Lord's out the whazzo, (plus the whole "sharing the same name as the Creator") can you blame us for looking up to you?

I know at least one King who does... and looks up to a certain Prime Minister as well.

The Tom, (V., that is) moves in mysterious ways; we don't have to destroy each other in order to understand him.

Marc Johnson