JeVondair Family/Selenia/Deliberations
JeVondair's Question
I am having difficulty and need advice, player to player. You're an experienced story teller and, in my opinion, a fine player of this game. It kind of reminds me of the old days where Rynn would rely on Kharyn as his sounding board. So please, hear me out.
To me, Selenia feels as though she is in a strange twilight. She feels like everything she's built has come undone. She has resigned herself, she's seen too many friends, vassals, and disciples die. She's had to smuggle her only son out of the country with Gia just to give him a better chance at life. In the past few days, she's not spoken a word to anyone. She's morose, bereft of motivation bc she sees no future for herself. After all, her leadership brought her people to ruin, she failed, she was defeated. I fully expected her to die gloriously defending Xavax one last time, or if she didn't actually die, I was going to pause her if a TO was ever started in Xavax City.
But Messages from the north keep piling up. Redwings asking her what to do, foreign leaders asking her for her influence in controlling her people. On the one hand, as a player, I could step back, keep Sel depressed and quiet and in doing so leave the redwings and the north with the adventure of figuring things out for themselves. I've prepared Selenia to die. She's ready. I'm ready. A new chapter in the East was about to begin: one without her. OR, I could reinvigorate Sel, have her provide the guidance and control that is being requested of her. Rally the nobles left in Xavax for one last push and bring her herself to live in the north in Exile, gather her supporters around herself, and do what she does best...
I could do that, I really could, but for the first time in a long time, I don't know what to do. My first responsibility as Selenia's player has always been to make things fun for the folks who play with me. What should I do? Should I bring her north? Should I let her die? Will the "Redwings," in your opinion, have more fun interpreting what they think she'd want them to do, or would they rather her take the lead again?
I could really use the advice.
– JeVondair
Responses
Out-of-Character from Garas Gabanus (20 hours, 18 minutes ago)
Thanks for the compliment and the feeling is mutual.
You are in a tough situation and I think as a player it'll be tough for me to tell you what to do, but perhaps I can guide you. I had a similar situation when I rejoined like a week ago (not sure if you missed me the last 6 months :p) and I wanted to leave Garas paused and in stead RP the daughter the player of Catherine Chamberlain and myself created (a bit like the Leroux family played their son Goran for quite a while) as it would create some awesome RP opportunities etc and give me as a player a semi-fresh start, but then I heard Catherine had autopaused and the Leroux family had paused Goran as well and well here Garas is. The reason I did that is because I realise I'm a (big) part of why Oligarch is and was fun. Firstly I put in quite a lot of effort also in trying to get allies and stuff done etc and in the realm itself, motivate everyone, plus my somewhat unorthodox military strategies have always worked so far, giving us a fighting chance. I felt like I would let people down if I return and then play as a char who doesn't know much about military strategies + Oligarch is my baby and I hate to see it destroyed. For me those were the reasons to make my (similar) decision.
I think what you have to ask yourself mostly are the following: 1) If you revive Selenia into activity, would you as a player have fun, or would it feel more as a burden? If it'll be more a burden, then people will be gratefull for the effort you put into making their game fun and will respect it and you should go with what does give you more fun and let Selenia die.
2) If you'd consider it fun, you'll have to decide for yourself how much you value the fact that you not only try to make it fun for yourself, but also for others and also look if you can't do an equally great job with a new char as you did with Selenia. If Selenia can provide other people more fun and you value that (main reason for me at least) then you should consider letting her live in exile. A story can always grow and even if Oligarch falls (quite likely at this point) then I can move into a next phase with those who'd enjoy it: (hint: something with revenge) just as your phase would be the rebuild of Xavax prob.
I do know one thing from a personal pov, Sirion is one of the worst realms I've played in and from what I hear it hasn't changed. Hardly any RP, very restrictive decisicion making and information sharing etc. I made Oligarch a Tyranny (with a Prime Minister) and did everything in the opposite way (share everything, discuss everything with all nobles and try to RP quite a bit) as a little bit of sarcasm, but I guess the point was missed. Perhaps if those in Xavax integrate they could make it more fun, or they'll fall into the trap and make their Sirion char the 'mindless' char and focus on other islands. I've seen it happen before, it's one of the reasons Oligarch was founded in the first place. It's a tricky situation, that's for sure as the dream of Xavax will prob fall if you do so (there are already 2 camps right now and some will just integrate into Sirion prob).
Hope this helps. You can spin Selenia's story both ways easily, her people begging her to rebuild it in the north and join them (keeping the dream alive and listening to her people) or dying a heroic death and become a martyr.
– John Reumerman
Out-of-Character from Viktoria Von Striga (20 hours, 17 minutes ago)
I would say that there isn't a correct answer to this question, as any choice you make will have its own stories to develop given how you've been playing her and how you are as a player.
I think the question, really, is what you want for her.
Would you like Selenia to be a queen-in-exile? If that's the case then sure, bring her north and see what happens. Certainly Selenia's presence will quell rumours and second-guessing as she will quickly resume her role in leading the Redwings. But does that fit Selenia? The Xerarch that you've been roleplaying is one of suitably fiery courage and personality. Can you give her a reason to not die with Xavax?
On the other hand you have her go out in a last stand as you mentioned. Certainly it would create great fuel (and RP material) for others to preserve her legacy. Naturally, there will be succession crises as various members come forward with their own interpretation of what Selenia would have wanted. The Redwings might stay together, or they might scatter among the northern realms for better or worse. Are you okay with that?
Personally, I would never encourage another player to kill off a character because we put so much heart and soul into them. But if you're prepared to do so with Selenia - ready, even - to use this opportunity as a climatic conclusion to a chapter in the JeVondair family history, then I say more power to you.
I apologise if this hasn't really given you a clear answer. But I hope this might help to sway your decision in either direction :)
– Jerrald
Out-of-Character from Asher Renodin (20 hours ago)
This is a game and you should do what is fun, for you. That is absolutely paramount. If you are ready to be done with Selenia, by all means be done with her. Pause her, delete her, do what you think is right in that regard.
Having said that, and the above should be the preamble for whatever comes next in my typing here, here's my take on things. Selenia is a brilliant icon. A pillar in so much that she is not just part of the structure, she is the structure. Everything revolves around her. Its the classical situation where a nation flourishes under the guidance of a single leader but as soon as that leader is taken out or disappears, that nation enters a dark age. Most prominent example I can give, Roman transition from Republic to Empire. The First Emperor, whom referred to himself as First Citizen, was a brilliant man. Octavius, adopted son of Julius Ceasar, later Augustus.
He basically created this wonderful system for everything. Balanced everything perfectly. People loved him. All went well when he was around and he lived a good long time. However, he never dealt with the issue of succession and neither the problem or rather relation between Future Emperors and the Senate. Senate here being the general power structure / establishment. When he was around, he word was law basically and all agreed it was good. After he was gone, it wasn't sure who should succeed and based on what merit. Neither how the old power structure should deal or act in the face of a new leader aka Emperor.
Ever since, the Roman Empire had a really hard time defining the relationship of Leader and Power structure and who should be leader. Selenia is that first Emperor. Everything is great with her around but there is nothing that deals with what comes after her. So, what are the options?
You could keep Selenia around in Greater Xavax. That will see your efforts split in two and one, the northern contingent (some 10 players) slowly erode into Sirion and Sirion become much stronger. Effectively losing that playerbase.
You could recall the north. That wouldn't do much good as there is no gold in the south to do anything meaningful.
You could go north and force the rest to follow you. That opens up several options of itself. Stay in Sirion and try things that way. Side with one of the smaller realms and shake stuff up that way.
You could remain in the south and keep vigorous contact with the north, attempting to maintain unison and cohesion. Effectively having a foreign legion of sorts? A mercenary army that could travel realms and do your bidding that way. But that may seem a bit of a stretch seeing the culture of Xavax.
What would I do? Sirion is one of the oldest Realms in the game and they have 22 nobles without Xavax's numbers added. Shadowdale is ready to abandon sirion's alliance. Eppy isn't feeling too safe from the south. First Oligarch may be lost now, unless you can pull a miracle from your hat. Well, what would I do? It seems to me that the time for meaningful action in the south is over. There's simply no money felt to face Vix or any of the realms there. The alliance too powerful to overcome. Distance is a savior in itself. There are a couple of options in the north that seem the most fun and in line with Selenia's Goals. To change the world. To bring about change.
But i'll end as I started, Do what you feel is fun, for you. Don't feel chained by responsibility or guilt for or towards fellow players. It's a game, think about yourself.
Gonna copy paste a bit of your letter and write some direct, terse answers.
I could do that, I really could, but for the first time in a long time, I don't know what to do.Do what you want to do, what is most fun for yourself. Unburdened by anything and naked towards your own enjoyment.
My first responsibility as Selenia's player has always been to make things fun for the folks who play with me.
Self imposed. Keep in mind that this is a game and you need to have fun playing it, not getting stressed out or worse, burned out. You build a pretty amazing Ingame Realm with fantastic lore. Adhered to by a good chunk of players. A big achievement.
What should I do?
See my first answer hmm?
Should I bring her north?
If you feel that continuering Selenia's story in the way she had behaved in the past? then yes.
Should I let her die?
This will probably be a move that you will regret. If you want to take a break heed that most ancient of BM advice, Pause.
Will the "Redwings," in your opinion, have more fun interpreting what they think she'd want them to do, or would they rather her take the lead again?
The Redwings are lunatics. Hahaha. They will be ducks in a pond without you. They are so used to leaning on Selenia's leadership that they don't know what to do without her guidance. Hence why they are so absolutely resistant towards Asher and his option. Without Selenia to lead them, there is no Redwing. It will very quickly crumble. The name will live on for a while but it will be one of those words / name that gets mentioned every now and then to remind or invoke glories of past days.
There, answered. It would be a damn shame if you left this story to peter out by itself. Like a mighty campfire that once proudly roared at the night sky, forcing people to back off due to sheer heat. Only to wilt away, starved of fuel as people go to sleep, late at night. Cozy at first by the lessing flames and then, the next morning, vaguely remember the blaze that held their imaginations in captivity. They will murmur to one another about it but the day after that, It will be a memory no longer even spoken about.
Cheers,
– Tim Care
