Talk:Abington the 2nd

Merge contents with Abington?

For a realm that lasted for such a short time and was only attempting to continue an old Atamaran name, it seems strange that this secession is known as 'Abington II.' As though it was substantially different from the first realm. Surely this would be better off included on the Abington page, much like the recent resurrection of Southasland was tastefully integrated into that page. --Revan 19:06, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

To me, the reincarnation of the realm should have its own page. This is especially important in that the "reincarnation" of the realm may have nothing whatsoever to do with the original realm of that name. If the second/third/etc. realm of that name makes it and becomes a true realm in its own right, then the old realm page should be moved, and the new one take its place, a la Fronen and Fronen/Old Fronen. --Indirik 20:05, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

That's exactly my point. This resurrection seems too insignificant and shortlived to justify it's own page and would be better off being mentioned in the main Abington article. I'm not suggesting we should make this a precedent, just that in this case, it hardly seems necessary. The realm was gone in two weeks and there is barely a paragraph's worth of text written about it. At the very least if it does stay, we ought to move the page to Abington II as is conventional with other realms that take on the names of dead realms --Revan 21:19, 25 February 2009 (UTC)

This is a tricky situation. We either have to have Tom make it impossible for realms to be reborn with the exact same name, have a different realm pages with one being incorrect(Old Khthon was never a realm; it was named Khthon which was later reborn with the same name), use something with disambiguations such as Abington (Original) and/or Abington (Reborn), or merge pages like I did with Southasland. I prefer one of the last two options, but I don't think I'll edit the page yet until we can come to a consensus on this. I'm probably most inclined to merge the pages because Riombara has done the same and it would be difficult to unmerge them. I really hate realms being reborn for exactly these reasons. --Vita Family 20:17, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

If a realm I lived in died off after 2k+ days, and then after a year or two some joker decided to split off his duchy from someplace else and ride off of the good name of my former realm... well, given the success rate of these rebirths and how well they tend to emulate their original namesakes, I'd quite likely be pissed. And wouldn't like to have this new sparkling of a realm leave any markers on my former lawn. Just an opinion. --Mr Jones 07:40, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Speaking as the joker in question who split off his duchy (although, admittedly, in the heart of what used to be Abington territory), I would suggest that it be under one page. It really is barely a footnote in Abington's long history, and I was quite shocked to discover that someone had actually made a separate page for it. Besides, as far as Damian was concerned, Abington hadn't really died, and he was just...Uncovering it, as it were. Quite mad, Damian was...But he would have been horrified to learn that his "Abington" was listed as a different realm. Shwartzring 08:35, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

I don't think any of that should be an issue. Malice gave Southasland the cold shoulder when it was reborn precisely because it had nothing to do with the old Southasland. But that doesn't mean the new Southasland could not have become a new and established realm in its own right. --Revan 10:33, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

I don't think it makes sense to stop the creation of realms with old names. As old names mean old claims of authority and power, and as BattleMaster has become increasingly claim based, it makes sense to be able to stake a claim to power through older vessels. Just because a realm isn't around ought not diminish the fact that you were the last Noble of its Royal line to rule that Kingdom. It makes the game more interesting.

All that said, I do like the idea of Disambiguations. Or that thing where at the top of the page it says something like 'You may be looking for the original Kingdom of Abington.' But only in cases where a reborn realm establishes itself at least for a time as a significant and unique entity. I still don't think Abington II cuts it. --Revan 10:33, 28 February 2009 (UTC)